msb discrete dac vs chord dave

Point 75 EmmLab Dac2 I paid 9K$ for this on 2010. In my assessment the Makua offered a more open and spacious sound. This puts it up against some serious competition! it just complimented my system better than those other two. An exploration of Chord DAVE, MScaler, Qutest, and Holo May, HQPlayer Lots of time it The sonic signature is detailed and yet easy to listen to, with the Discrete bringing a sense of the recordings scale (big or small) to the listening experience. This is a very odd one to describe but came to the fore on tracks like Pan Eros from World Of Drums and Percussion. Couldn't agree more. It's easy! Let us do the work of refurbishing and finding your current electronics a new hometheyll continue to be enjoyed for years to come. which make some people prefer this one to MSB Select II Point 85 Chord Dave and Mscaler (or Blue II transport) This one give transparent and 3D soundstage with excellent details. MSBs top-level DAC is 121K and there are other brands out there offering very expensive options, but the truth is that the vast majority of people will never feel the need to spend that kind of money (even if they could) to eek out that last-minute bit of detail. Also, it is worth noting I heard the v1 DAC 2X, not the v2. About Chord Vs Dac Discrete Msb Dave . But the differences between great DACs is small. Our digital testing has been done over the last 20 + years The reasoning behind the two clocks dealing with different frequency families is that music is mostly recorded within multiples of the 44.1kHz family or the 48kHz family and having a clock dealing with each family minimises loss. If so I'd recommend the Aqua Formula xHD and the TotalDAC d1-Seven. I'm also a very patient person and can wait for the right bit of kit at the right price to come up secondhand. and build quality is also excellent. Anyway, the MSB Discrete is a machine that I consider to be highly resolving and a true HiFi product with regard to the definition I quoted above. Strangely, this new review is not displayed when you select the review folder on the homepage. a year ago I got the new Renderer V2 which was a step up over USB. The clock can be seen as being the heart of the DAC and once again the clocks are made in-house. Dealer's should be required to state they're a dealer every time they post or have a disclaimer in their username. It could sound analytical or hot coupled with bright combination of speaker and amplifier. What didn't you like about the Dave? The evolution of the original irreverent and irrelevant and non-authoritative site for headphone measurements, i.e. There are separate optimal PCM and DSD modes for playbacks and bit perfect playback is how DAVE performs optimally as the FPGA up samples and noise shapes everything to 104MHz 5-bit. I cant help with comparisons of two of these DACs, but I did hear the Tambaqui up against the dCS Bartok and it was a pretty close call, but ultimately the dCS sounded more analogue and more immersive.However, this was at a time when both units were a similar price. and as I said earlier there is no "best" when it comes to dacs or Although I would like to keep this as close to $10-12K as possible. More sharing . As you pursue higher levels of playback, an MSB upgrade path is always available to help drive your own desire for innovation. that it is difficult to say you have the best in regard to dacs but Rockna is Tellurium Silver Diamond USB and Chord Blu. StereoNET (Australia) is part of an international network of publications owned wholly by Sound Media Group (Australia). What else should one expect? UPnP Protocol The world's largest high-end audio community. Personally, I think that both these standpoints have their merits and its going to be a case of you paying your money and you taking your choice. Up to 32 bit 768kHz Rori is definitely welcome. It's pretty funny how everyone gives their personal pet recommendation with the utmost confidence that the buyer will like it. 2 DAC | Audionet Pre G2 preamp | Audionet Max mono blocks | Vivid Audio Giya G2 Series 2 | 4 JL Audio Fathoms | Echole ICs /SCs / Siltech Classic 550L jumpers, Shunyata PCs / Eth. None, despite working back as I always do if theres an issue! DACs Overview - MSB Technology Others might disagree but these are my findings. Focusing on our network renderer and USB input, your audio tech will be on the cutting edge. The formats that is used in comparison test is all 16bit / 44.1KHz, not DSD The Result : 1st : Select DAC II Full Option - 100% 2nd : Trinity DAC - 90% That's just too money for the performance. Playing Gil Scott-Heron and Brian Jacksons Your Daddy Loves You from the Winter in America album gave me the same impression of a reach-out-and-touch soundscape with incredibly well-defined positions in the mix and a whole load of detail the over-driven sound of the electric piano at around a minute forty really stood out as being faithful to the recording; a case of high-fidelity highlighting a low-fidelity artefact? I can see the problem with this unit. Do diamonds shine on the dark side of the moon? Was it a speaker setup or headphone setup? In that time, weve pushed the industry forward with each product weve built, redefining whats possible. Anyone make that comparison? Click here to download your copy, At 11000 plus taxes as tested the Lampizator Big 7 is certainly no budget DAC, but does it deliver on sonic ability? By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies. Also; recently MSB introduced a new interface that optimizes USB and adds fibre to reduce noise, the MSB Pro USB. That's the negative to going my route I guess. They are all excellent DACs and at that level of performance, it's ultimately about system synergy, personal preferences and the limitations of our hearing. It is just as important as the DAC itself. Well this is going to set the cat amongst the pigeons for sure. It may not display this or other websites correctly. In terms of sound quality, it's the best digital front end I . retail client forgets that most audio stores and audio distribution companies And if I had to guess (given I haven't heard both), I'd guess it outperforms the Tambaqui. Best DACs comparison test result [[My Subjective Opinion]] I submit dealers use the statement "component X competes against much more expensive components" far too often. Stuart Smith finds out. 2. Putting price aside, what are your thoughts about the Hugo TT as an integrated DAC+amp? very important and our preference connection is an i2S connection. http://www.computeraudiophile.com/members/mikejazz/, funded this campain: http://igg.me/at/geekpulseaudio/x/5216671. DAVE is perfect for headphone system because you can save space and money of headphone amplifier. This is THE place where audiophiles and audio companies discuss vintage, contemporary and new audio products, music servers, music streamers, computer audio, digital-to-analog converters, turntables, phono stages, cartridges, reel-to-reel tape machines, speakers, headphones and tube and solid-state amplification. Look, says I theres obviously a fault with this unit as its lighting up, I can see it on the network and I can send tunes to it via the Stack streamer and Roon! We went through everything and I was getting ready to pack it up and send it back when I reached around the back of one of the PSUs and switched it on MUSIC!!! Analogue Volume Control 1dB from 0 to 106 Deactivable by menu, Dimensions ChassisWidth : 432 mmDepth: 305 mmHeight without feet: 51 mm. Sent from my SM-G928V using Computer Audiophile mobile app. So this was headphones straight out of the DAVE? Best DACs comparison test result [[My Subjective Opinion]] After a year of listening to various components I'm content. You must log in or register to reply here. Height with feet: 68 mm Weight: 8.2 kg, Accessories included: Manual Remote control Aluminum MSB USB charging cable 4 X Spikes and Cups 4 X plastic inserts Power connector splitter, MERASON FRROT DAC REVIEW The Merason Frrot DAC costing 995 isn't the first thing that comes to mind when we think of Switzerland. Only hifi shops and shows hear and there. I may need to reset expectations a bit lower: This is an update to some old DAVE vibration control posts. Thanks. SO/ROON/HQPe: DSD 256-Sonore opticalModuleDeluxe-Signature Rendu optical--Bricasti M3 DAC--DIY Purifi Amplifier-Focus Audio FS888 speakers-JL E 112sub-Nordost Tyr USB, DIY EventHorizon AC cables, Iconoclast XLR & speaker cables, Synergistic Purple Fuses, Spacetime system clarifiers. I think people buy what they like. But digital, potentially, can change things. I hope to also have an opportunity to listen to a T+A DAC8 (for DSD512) and a Chord Dave (DSD256) in my system soon (with HQPlayer). The DACs are individually shielded and thermally-bonded and multiple units are used per channel, which MSB tells us increases performance and lowers output impedance. Thank you, Mike. Chord Dave DAC "Sealed Box Brand New" Never Opened !! There are some tonal differences too, but what you prefer will depend on your other equipment and the music you like. Right now my favorite DACs in my system are the Pacific Microsonics Model 2 (for PCM), Phasure NOS1a (for PCM), Meridian Ultra (for MQA), and the Playback Designs MPS5 (for DSD128). Or arm yourself with a nice bottle of red and pay a visit to@Stereophilus. The Discrete is a genuine high fidelity DAC and a fabulously built one to boot, add in the modular input flexibility and you have a pretty stunning product with excellent future proofing. The next module is the display which is a cool and easy-to-read LED that is slaved to the audio clock. A Chord DAC converts to analog via Chord's "Pulse Array DAC" which is a discrete circuit, similar to the discrete circuit used in the MSB DACs (but not the same). This is THE place where audiophiles and audio companies discuss vintage, contemporary and new audio products, music servers, music streamers, computer audio, digital-to-analog converters, turntables, phono stages, cartridges, reel-to-reel tape machines, speakers, headphones and tube and solid-state amplification. But it need good system matching. Of course this DAC is super pricey and out of the reach of many (including me). But DAVE also seems to me to highlight the original recording so if the recording is flat, the playback sounds flat (still with great accurate timbre) but if the recording really showcase the soundstage and the 3-dimensionality of the instruments and vocals, DAVE really portrays that well. The MSB simply sounded more real to my ears and offered a more convincing soundstage and tonality and all the tiny informations in the music where integrated in the musical flow whereas the DAVE simply sounded flat and not realistic to my ears and even lacked those tiny informations. It is my name after all! The SQ is amazingly good. Regardless if the buyer has never auditioned the unit, and found it corresponding to, Simaudio Moon Neo 260 DT CD Transport / Empirical Audio reclocking system: Synchro-Mesh Reclocker driven by Dynamo Linear Power Supply, 2 x Reference BNC digital cable / Schiit Yggdrasil Less is More (LIM) DAC / Octave HP 700 preamp / Octave RE 320 stereo amp with Super Black Box / Reference 3A Reflector monitors, on Sound Anchors Signature stands / dual JL Audio Fathom 112 v2 subwoofers / Cables: ZenWave Audio D4 interconnects, ZenWave SMSG speaker cables / Diverse Herbie's Audio Lab footers / Acoustic treatment: Tri-panels, window plugs, ceiling diffusers (all ASC), diverse carpets chosen for acoustic properties (wool, polypropylene basketweave), Sure absolutely agree that paying that much money without auditioning (preferably in my house, with my own equipment, in my room) does not make much sense. The DAC has two modes; multi-bit PCM and single-bit discrete DSD mode. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. I've also learned that a DAC's performance will depend heavily on the music player. I'm not an absolutist, and frankly, I could be happy with any of the DACs I mentioned. Chord DAVE - DAC - Digital to Analog Conversion - Audiophile Style Founded in 2010 Whats Best Forum invites intelligent and courteous people of all interests and backgrounds to describe and discuss the best of everything. I have the Berkeley Alpha Reference DAC, waiting for an upgrade. Sounds shrill on my workstation and work laptop. I also looked at the MSB Discrete DAC but everything thing was an extra cost option (USB, AES/EBU, power supply, etc.,) and expensive. Anyway, I switched out the valve power amplifier and put in its place the Krell KST100 (all fully fettled and brought up to a better than new spec by Krell in the States) with my intention being to see what effect was the DAC and what was down to the amp basically isolating the effect to a component. This ranking is just my subjective thinking. Impedance 100 Low Gain setting. https://www.linkedin.com/in/john-rothschild-70aab85/, Headphones and Personal Audio with Pitch Perfect Service. The Discrete DAC, The Premier DAC, The Reference DAC, The Select DAC II, Theater Master. There are some tonal differences too, but what you prefer will depend on your other equipment and the music you like. All rights reserved. Perhaps thats a bit of an odd example for me to use as its a bit World Music but you are also made aware of the rightness of timing on percussive techno tracks. I like all this attention to detail and the MSB website suggests a company that is massively proud of its American heritage and of the products they make. Then we have the Integrated Clock module and Im starting to get the whole modular approach to the design of the MSB DAC. But MSB Select 2 is regarded by many as the best thats why for something 1/10 of the price to compete in anyones eyes is quite an accomplishment. @ricred1, youre right to point that out. Up to 1km lossless transmission. I havent heard the Rockna. I hate to repeat myself, but there are no absolutes in audio, only preferences. the Extreme has some special optimization for USB. You'll be shocked by how much you lose by going through a separate preamp. More to follow. Dedicated Line DSD/DXD | Audirvana+ | iFi iDSD Nano | SET Tube Amp | Totem Mites, Surround: VLC | M-Audio FastTrack Pro | Mac Opt | Panasonic SA-HE100 | Logitech Z623, DIY: SET Tube Amp | Low-Noise Linear Regulated Power Supply | USB, Power, Speaker Cables | Speaker Stands | Acoustic Panels, You need to be a member in order to leave a comment. I recently bought a DAC with a digital volume control precisely to bypass the preamp, but when I compared the two approaches there was very little between them. I'm looking for suggestions on DACs I should listen to as possible replacement of my Chord Dave. The The lo-res display also makes menu ]set-up fiddly because it doesn't have enough space to display words. Strangely from this company is lack of any anti-aliasing on the text causing pixels to not be seen in the fonts chosen! The only true way for the end user to know what they prefer is through listening in their own system. There is a real sense of spectacle and scale when the MSB is in the system. This kind of sound really appeals to me and was really excellent to experience on lots of tunes, but was especially evident on tracks from Rumours with every part of the mix being identifiable as unique. Since the Topping D70s SINAD is ~120 dB and it costs ~$650, then given that "money is power" (as opposed to amplitude), I would expect the Chord DAVE SINAD to be at least 120 + 10*log($14,000 / $650) = 133.3 dB. If you take a look at their website you will see that the machining shop is a fully equipped facility designed to meet the needs of a company producing high-quality cases in which the electronics will be fitted no off the shelf or cheap bent metal cases here! It doesnt get too hot to touch. Moving away from the actual sound of the music, one of my main takeaways from listening to the Discrete was the sense of timing it brought to music. Tailored for both the transport and the DACs daily use, our remote brings you closer to the music you love. It's better than the MSB Analog I listened to. comparing top dacs directly is a bit challenging, even if you have them both together. At MSB, we believe excellence is a promise worth keeping. for instance, the Select II is modular (customers can easily change modules in seconds)so it has the ability to quickly modify its inputs to allow for optimization of various interfaces. Its not bombarding you with information, but it is a notably more defined sound with regards to the spatial information and the way that elements sit in the mix a tad more solidity and more of a sense of the stereo image being wider and deeper and with instruments and sounds occupying a definite space of their own. Still, it's the way I prefer at this stage. You could try some of the newer dacs that has gotten good reviews. Hmm.. It is not hard to audition these DACs in Melbourneand this is your best way to work out your own preference. MSB Technology Discrete Modular DAC Page 2 | Hi-Fi News Aurender W20-> Lampizator Pacific SE -> Ayon Crossfire III or Circle Labs A100 -> Avantgarde Acoustic Trio LE 26 with 4x REL Carbon Special ,SACD Player: Audio Aero La Fontaine. CHORD Dave could be the most expensive deeply design DAC in the world and if you find it not your taste there is the best off the shelf DACs like akm4499 in Topping D90 for 699$ that could be even better than Dave. msb discrete dac vs chord dave - 1click3d.com Can I ask how you procured all those DACs? Site Founder | Site Owner | Administrator, https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/absolute-top-tier-dac-for-standard-res-redbook-cd. Set up is key, cables are super important, server is also Thirdly, having suggested that the brightness issue may lay elsewhere, I will shortly post a suggested tweak directly to both HMS and DAVE - that I have found to increase the "weight", "solidity" and "analogueness" of the resulting sound. DLNA Protocol. Needless to say given everything talked about so far, the Prime DAC modules are made in-house and they have been making and designing discrete ladder DACs since 1999. And in the case of a great DAC with great amps in a system with very low noise, going direct to the amps can be magical. I listen mostly to classical music, particularly with symphonic work, I prefer DAVE to MSB. This DAC is 11,000 and as such, it is a considerable investment to make, but I would suggest that this is not stupid money for the kind of transparency and clarity it brings. This effect was evident on track after track but didnt feel like it was overly exaggerated. There is the option to add a streaming module to the Discrete and if I was in the market for a digital streaming solution, then this is where I would be going. Wavedream only has a couple hours on it, but from the first note it DAVE is the most advanced DAC Chord Electronics has ever made. MSB Discrete | The Ear 2. To me, the instrumental timbre seems more accurate with DAVE than any other DACs I've heard. I say take what everyone post when a grain of salt, because an individual's preference may be different than yours. will every hear. This is a dealers email comment to me about comparisons he did. The other thing I've learned about the Chord Dave is it can sound very different depending on the interconnect and/or power cord used. Triangle Magellan Concerto 2< AQEverest< Vitus Audio SS-010 Mk2< AQDragon High Current< AQWELXLR< ChordQutestDAC w UpTone JS-2 & AQ Dragon Source < AQDiamond USB< InnuosPhoenix USBwAQ Dragon Source< AurenderN100H & AQ Dragon Source< NetGear GS105GESwitch w UpTone LPS1.2< Supra CAT8 Ethernet Mola Mola Pre/dac review compared to DAVE dac - Page 2 - DAC - Digital I believe it comes down to Does anyone have formula for that? "Im not sure if there are algorithms that can add high-frequency information that wasnt captured in the original sampled result". By JavaScript is disabled. At $20,000 I recommend the MSB Premier DAC with two power supplies (KeithRs system). I don't want to waste hifi shops time too much knowing I'll be going second hand either. The AC modules are fully balanced at every stage, have no buffers, IV converters, or transistors in the signal path, and have no active devices used in the conversion process at all. Ok, I looked a prat but it proves that the separate PSUs are actually doing something rather than being there for show, though they do look rather cool in themselves. This is the main advantage of DAVE (i.e. Search: Msb Discrete Dac Vs Chord Dave. My first serious audio system was Garrard turntable, Fisher Int(SS), ADS bookspeaker bought on 1978. state his/her experience and preferences. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. However, its also very nice to listen to in this system, though I would say it is more accurate/true to the original DAC than our LAB12 DAC or perhaps our Lampizator BIG 7. When I have done the comparison with other DACs I have had at the same time - Ayre QX5-Twenty, EAR Dac 4, exasound e32 - often the immediate impression is that DAVE/Blu 2 is not quite as good - a bit dryer sounding, not quite as smooth, not as airy or three dimensional And yet, over the longer term, it is deeply satisfying at a musical level in a way that the other DACs are not. there are others I know about but Ive not heard them recently. Congratulations on the upgrade and enjoy it in good health. Each clock is made up of two independent clocks but only one is used at any given time so as not to add unwanted noise to the circuit. This gives us lots of headroom for future sample rates and audio formats.. Both DACs connected directly to power amp using each DACs volume controle. Yes, you read that right, the Select DAC is the best part of 121,000! Digital: DACs, USB converters, decrapifiers, A healthy approach to understanding measurements, After being asked for the 308th time, Merv lists top 5 headphones, $1000 to the first to design a headamp using discrete components with better measurements than Magni 3+, http://www.computeraudiophile.com/f6-dac-digital-analog-conversion/chord-dave-29757/#post579518, (You must log in or sign up to reply here.). Taiko Audio Extreme > Sablon Audio Reserva Elite USB2022/Sablon Audio Reserva Ethernet2020> Aqua Formula XHDV2 > Sablon Audio King Sablon Interconnects > LDR pre > PuLSar45 DC SE amp > Sablon Audio Reserva speaker cables (pigtailed) > Avantgarde Duo Omega( Duelund xover). Thanks for the suggestion ecwl. I haven't heard MSB or theDenafrips DAC. Actually the ChordHugo M Scaler and the Blu Mk. It would only sound like sales so we connection to the dac chip. You are using an out of date browser. So, essentially, around the back of this DAC we have XLR output modules, dual power inputs (more on this in a moment) the digital input module (XLR, RCA, and two optical), and the USB input. Audiogon Discussion Forum Since opening our doors in 1986, weve been driven by one goal: to craft an unrivaled listening experience for music lovers across the globe. more might come to mind and I will add them. Over the air updates will ensure that your renderer always has the latest capabilities and ultimate convenience. The modular nature of MSB products allows you to have the bits you want and leave out those you dont, The display is a bit basic but it does what it needs to and you can see it from the other side of the room, Detail and transparency are the main features, Allows a real insight into the makeup of a track, Brings a sense of timing being bang on the money, Detail isnt a result of the higher frequencies being artificially pushed, Both PSUs are not absolutely necessary but once you remove one you want to put the other back in. The world's largest high-end audio community. johndoe21ro Never use!! Yes, definitely, as it is those extra tiny little bits of detail that adds the cherry on top of an already rather splendid slice of musical cake brought out on tracks like the audio show mainstay Keith Dont Go from Acoustic Live by Nils Lofgren. This is a company that is All American and fiercely proud of that fact. How does it compare? Did you audition all of them in the same place with the same system? Unfortunately not, I'm going the second hand route as I've done with most of my setup. The bottom line for me is that great DACs can make a difference over good DACs. The only true way for the end user to know what they prefer is through listening in their own system.. Once you add the second discrete PS, and a module or two for it to work, the price goes over $23-24K. It is on kind loan from a member and costs US $14,000. The MSB simply offered more of everything and to my ears proved again that a true multi bit converter/ladder DAC is superior to delta/sigma or FPGA DACs. Its weighty, it feels perfect, its not overly ostentatious and its perfect! Still would like to listen to the Soulution 760 DAC, Mola Mola DAC, Trinity DAC, MSB Select DAC, and maybe the Light Harmonic Da Vinci DAC, Gryphon Kalliope DAC, TotalDAC of some kind, Phasure NOS1A DAC, Esoteric Grandioso DAC, TAD DA1000 DAC, Audionet DAC, Chord Dave DAC . The more observant of you will have read this and noticed that there is no mains inlet. - Meat Loaf. I'm looking for suggestions between $10K - $12K. The Premier DAC Features - MSB Technology There is no dark magic involved.

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msb discrete dac vs chord dave